Evaluations....secrets

[Greg O]

I am a little curious about the evaluation process of all the different leagues around.

My kids currently playing house trying out for Development Team(aka Selects?!?)

For example my son plays house U10 trying for U11 Development Team for Fall 2018

- assessments are being made during the Fall Sep-March season apparently. Where players can be moved up to join development teams and be assessed.
- parent coaches are being asked for their input
- you can sign up your child for a development tryout.

Spoke with my parent coach and he said no one approached him in regards to any players on our team....4 parents put their kids name in the hat to sign their kids up for assessment and all 4 did get it.
I also saw 1 time club staff with a clipboard look at players.

So I am curious, The 4(including my son) end up being actually observed or were invited to the assessments purely because parents signed them up?

I honestly can say my son is NOT the best on our house team in fact I was thinking 2 other players would be there as well as I thought they played better through the year.

Kids did their assessments and now we gotta wait to see if they made it or not.

- during the speeches being given by staff to parents it is the usual stuff. Kids go up and down all the time. Not the end of the world etc.

One parent asked What are you looking for? No straight answer was given. He asked again:
- you want a kid that plays well in his/her position or simply a kid that always fights for the ball? No answer was provided.

I am curious as to the criteria that kids are judged on? Wouldn’t mind actually hearing or getting criticism/feedback as to there Performance.

What happened to the days when names were simply posted on a Blackboard or paper and you looked for your name as to whenever so and so made it? Seems now it’s more...complicated....

Some parents said Hockey is worse....don’t know as my kids don’t play any...

 

[TKBC]

Evaluations will happen differently at every club, and within clubs will be different at ages some of the time. This is a difficult scenario, and it's unfortunate.

The questions you ask are pertinent. The staff won't really have an answer for you, which is also unfortunate.

I am a staff coach. I know exactly what I am looking for. The best technical players regardless of physical attributes. Of course the kids with the best technical skills are often also strong athletes. Some will look for athletes and then want to make them strong technical players. Some look for kids with high work rates. There is a minimum work rate required. No chance a kid who can dance with the ball but walks the entire time is making my team. But, I would speak with that kid and his parents and explain why they haven't been picked.

 

[Greg O]

I wrote the post last night as my daughter was doing her evaluation. The difference between my daughters and my sons evaluation approach was completely different by each club that’s why I am asking.

 

[Nate]

So one take away is at least the evaluation experience for RFC (boys) is consistent between age groups. We were told the U9's will select 2 teams consisting of 20-24 players. About 35~40 kids came out to the 3 evaluation sessions, all of whom stood out during the regular house league games.

Seems the kids who were motivated were given an opportunity to participate in the evaluations as i suspect very few (if any) were actually turned away. - IMO as it should be, why limit the potential player pool?

I did notice the drills and games in the evaluation sessions were good tests on various aspects of the game between individual and team based play. And I did see the TD and the Technical Lead for the age group spend significant time observing the groups.

 

[Greg O]

Nate you were there last Friday and Monday at Minoru? U9 had 3sessions? Our U10 group because of the snow in February was reduced to 2sessions (Friday and Monday).

Apparently U11 is looking for a total of 4teams(2gold and 2silver) for Fall 2018 season.

That being said we have to keep in mind there is currently already 3teams for U10 going into U11.

So to be realistic they looking for equivalent of 1 team and say 3extra players as backup in case someone moves or doesn’t resign with RFC. So probably say 15players.

 

[Nate]

Yes, the U9 evaluations had 3 sessions. was there Thurs, Friday last week and Tuesday. The Tues. session was a makeup session due to snow and field closures.

Would be interesting to hear of the contrast between the RGSA evaluations vs. the boys side.

 

[Greg O]

RFC u10 going to u11 evaluation was 2 sessions consisting of drills and sparring games going in different formats:

5v5
3v3 etc.

They currently had 3 teams in u10 development going into 4 teams for fall u11(2gold and 2silver).

While for the RGSA it was 4teams (2current RGSA Development Silver/Gold) vs the rookies(2teams) that were trying out. In each session they played 2games(20-25min each) vs a Development team. Mini Jamboree style.

What I didn’t like is how do they expect a bunch of players that some never played together to go against an actual development team?

In that scenario it was obvious that you would have individual players that would shine as no one really trusted another player with the ball. Games were 7v7 with a sub in hand.

From what I was informed the amount of development teams was 2(u10) and it will be 2 going into U11.... meaning pretty much say 3/4 of the current development team will stay the same except maybe if someone quits of there is a Really good player from HOUsE League that shines during those 2sessions.

RGSA said in an email they will release their Development Team Roster After their gala. Meaning middle of April in order to make sure everyone enjoys it....

 

[LauraH]

RFC u10 going to u11 evaluation was 2 sessions consisting of drills and sparring games going in different formats:

5v5
3v3 etc.

They currently had 3 teams in u10 development going into 4 teams for fall u11(2gold and 2silver).

While for the RGSA it was 4teams (2current RGSA Development Silver/Gold) vs the rookies(2teams) that were trying out. In each session they played 2games(20-25min each) vs a Development team. Mini Jamboree style.

What I didn’t like is how do they expect a bunch of players that some never played together to go against an actual development team?

In that scenario it was obvious that you would have individual players that would shine as no one really trusted another player with the ball. Games were 7v7 with a sub in hand.

From what I was informed the amount of development teams was 2(u10) and it will be 2 going into U11.... meaning pretty much say 3/4 of the current development team will stay the same except maybe if someone quits of there is a Really good player from HOUsE League that shines during those 2sessions.

RGSA said in an email they will release their Development Team Roster After their gala. Meaning middle of April in order to make sure everyone enjoys it....

Having had 2 kids go up through the "rep" system, one girl (out of it for 2 years) and one boy (final season), my advice is, don't try to understand it. The teams that are already established will basically stay the same, as you said, with maybe one or two additions. This is true for most of the way up through the age groups. Parents will try to understand why the evaluators did this, why they didn't watch that field, why they moved that kid to the other group...it'll drive you crazy. They'll make their selections and you have to live with it. And while I'm here, does anyone wonder why there are evaluations for 8 year olds?? I wonder how many of those kids will still be playing soccer at 17.

 

[Greg O]

Well said, last year my son didn’t make the selection. This year he did. But still I don’t get certain aspects of the selection.

As for my daughter it was her first year trying out we will see mid april.

 

[TKBC]

How did RFC determine they would have 2 gold, 2 silver u11? Why not 3 gold, 1 silver or 1 gold, 3 silver so on and so forth. LOL, a little jealous they can have 4 teams....my club can only get 2-3 at that age.

 

[Greg O]

Honestly no idea how they determined that.

 

[TKBC]

My guess is they observed the u10's thoroughly over the course of an entire season. And, couple with that after years of experience observing u11 they were able to determine this!.....right?......right?......anyone?

 

[MiaSanMia]

If your child isn't chosen to a select side now, don't fret. At the 2005 age group @ RFC we had a LOT of player movement through out the year. All moving UP. We had some players not chosen to the select stream work their way up to Gold, and one made it through to the metro side even.

I believe this particular age group and maybe the U12's was a model of how things should work. The technical lead was involved with teams at ALL levels from Bronze to Metro. He knew all the players. As a player was pulled from Gold to Metro, there were silver players ready to fill the void, and then Bronze players ready to fill that gap. I understand that the selection process can be tough, and that's why they are trying to get away from "evaluations" at all. Before even the end of fall all coaches had a good idea of who fit where. We had parents advise the TL who wanted to be considered for the select stream. Coaches met and discussed who was a good fit to see if they were ready for the next level. We invited the players out to train with the level that they were deemed to be ready for. So new faces @ Metro training, and gold and silver sessions. Because this was the norm during the year, the Players on said teams didn't think this was anything out of the ordinary. It worked well, and we'll be applying this through the spring programs as the boys are still growing and constantly changing. No spots are firm, there is always the potential for movement up and down, although much rarer for movement to happen down.

This model takes a LOT of co-operation between volunteer coaches and the TL to make it happen and understand that we are working to develop players and NOT about the win every week. The players moving up and playing on permits all know how we play so there is a seamless jump from one level to the next. It worked at this age group, but we had great communication between everyone.

 

[TKBC]

I think you've put a nice story together here - but for every kid that moves up another moves down. It may be that kids moved from silver, to gold to whatever....but at some point a player at the BCSPL, metro, or gold moved down - although this might not be as noticeable because Fusion is a collective, rather than a single club-fed team. So the players who leave that program move down to other communities (or other BCSPL I suppose - but that means someone left/dropped down from another BCSPL club).

For every kid that moves up, another moves down (unless a kid is moving on to Whitecaps or other pro opportunities, thus creating space for a kid to move up into their spot and none having to go down a tier or more).

 

[MiaSanMia]

This past season all the movement has been up. one or 2 kids dropped soccer(multisport kids who decided to focus some where else) One willingly gave up their Gold spot because they felt that they couldn't commit to the training requirements of select. The key for us was not selecting full 18 player rosters at the beginning of the season, so if someone really deserved to move up quickly, they could. If the programs are stable with numbers it would be grand to have movement up and down. We also let all players and parents know that they are not locked in to the spot at any particular level. If they can't keep up, they will be moved down. We did not have that issue at all. Another thing was a "soft" selection we did in spring and and firmed things out as the group went through spring training, so we were sure when the fall started, those players at any given level deserved to at the very least be where they are or push for a higher spot.

 

[TKBC]

A program can't take credit for promoting kids to replace kids who quit. That's misleading.

Having coached teams with 18 players I can say it's smart to go with 15-16. 18 is too many to ensure good playing time.

 

[MiaSanMia]

A program CAN take credit for having kids ready to take those spots with out seeing a drop in level.

 

[easoccer]

Over the years I coached several kids from Bronze and then Silver.

In that time I had boys who started with base skill but had athleticism and work ethic.

I certainly feel a lot of pride when I think about those that jumped to Gold and even a couple to Metro from Bronze.

At the same time I had kids who were on Gold teams come down, who Ive seen revitalized with playing time and positive environment.

Regardless if they go up or come down it was my pleasure to be a part of that.

 

[TKBC]

Over the years I coached several kids from Bronze and then Silver.

In that time I had boys who started with base skill but had athleticism and work ethic.

I certainly feel a lot of pride when I think about those that jumped to Gold and even a couple to Metro from Bronze.

At the same time I had kids who were on Gold teams come down, who Ive seen revitalized with playing time and positive environment.

Regardless if they go up or come down it was my pleasure to be a part of that.

and that's it right there!

 

[TKBC]

Because rosters are closed I am trying, in concert with my TD, to use a permit system for u12 this year. I will sign 10-11 tier 1 players, then sign 13-14 tier 2 players and call up 1-2 tier 2 players (not sure how many tier 1 players will sign at this point). The permit players will train with tier 1 that week, then play the game. I'll set it up on a rotation basis with identified tier 2 players (the top set of tier 2 players). The questions are "roster max" (how many can sign for a u12 tier 2 team) and if we can get the permits signed easily. If it works out, it should be fantastic.